Why to use distilled instead of dechlorinated

[emmac350]

A new article about a study done at the University of Portsmouth has found that antidepressants in the water make shrimp suicidal - they are more likely to swim TOWARD lights as opposed to away from them like they should.

Shrimp exposed to fluoxetine were five times more likely to swim towards light than away from it. That's dangerous because they would be more likely to be caught than escape, putting their populations at risk from over-fishing. In the study, the scientists only exposed the shrimp to the level of fluoxetine that would be excreted by people into the water supply and not taken out by traditional wastewater treatment methods. The study also notes at the end that there are many drugs that alter our brains the same way as fluoxetine that were not tested and would most likely have the same effect on the shrimp.

Article found at http://io9.com/5584563/antidepressants- ... p-suicidal and a link to the study is in the article.

[Niko]

Distilled water can be use for misting the tank, ornaments and sand, i'm agree with this. But i think that use it as drinking water can be dangerous for LHC. Distilled water don't contain dissolved ions, so when drink by any animal, it provokes a loss of ions, the ions cross the intestinal membranes and meet in the bowel. The water when to her cannot be absorbed, the result are strong diarrheas (diarrheas are losses of ions) to mammals and others animals.

With animals as the BHT, the Ionic balance of which is precarious and the object of a constant fight to be maintained at the good level, I think that an osmotic shock at the level of the digestive tract could have grave consequences for them.

It is my opinion and this hypothesis is based only on what it happens at the other animals.

Adding some water conditionner to tape water can reduce drastically the bioavailability of a lot of organic and inorganic substances, as heavy metals, pesticides, biocides.....and antidepressant. Water conditionner are chelatant of organic and inorganic substances, they catch them in molecular complexes wich are too large to cross biological membranes, so they are excreted.

[emmac350]

Crabs can get the dissolved ions that they need from their ocean water, though. That's why we offer ocean water - they need the ions in it to keep their abdomens from taking in too much water due to osmosis. So why wouldn't the ocean water be able to provide the ions that may be missing from their fresh water? Also, if your crabs splash like mine, or if they dunk in salt water and then go for the fresh water, they're adding ions to the fresh water. I just don't see why it's so necessary to have dechlorinated tap water, especially considering that the amount of chlorine in your water isn't always the same from day to day - sometimes they add more chlorine to the water to help flush out and clean their pipes, thus meaning that the amount of dechlorinator you'd use wouldn't be enough to neutralize all of the chlorine, or some days there may be less dechlorinator, meaning that the same amount of dechlorinator might be too much and leave some of that dechlorinator in the water, looking for something to bind to.

Oh, and just a note - I doubt whether distilled water would cause diarrhea in hermit crabs, if only because I used it exclusively as a drinking water for my crabs for almost two years now with no problems, and if I'm not mistaken, Marie (ladybug15057) has used it much longer than that with no issues either. I'm not trying to be a smart aleck here, just wanting to get all of the information out there for others to see.

[Niko]

Hi Emmac, thanks for your answer.

Chlorine isn't a big problem, whatever the amount in water, as it's a very volatil substance, you can easily evaporate it by bubbling water with an tank aerator and a stone. There is more concerns with other susbtances but adding water conditionners neutralize them easily as i've said it previously.

I've explain why it can be dangerous to give distilled water to animals, maybe it should be verified for LHC (off course they won't suffer from diahhrea (what a mess in the shells ), it was just about a parallel to explain that a loss of ions at the level of the digestive tract is possible at the other animals and probably at them) but as it's true and verified for many animals, I wonder why they would not be concerned. I'm not saying that distilled water will kill all LHC, but maybe it should be always used with not caution, and not for bathing in my opinion. For me rain water collected far from towns or industrial plants stays the best soft water to give to LHC (or other captive animals).

My opinion is also that in the nature, the LHC swallows ions when they drink some salt water but also when they drink some fresh water, the ions present in the fresh water not being necessarily the same that those presents in the salt water. The consumption of both types of water thus participates in the contribution in ions, and the salt water is not necessarily there to replace what would miss in the fresh water.

It is only the personal opinion which is especially justified by the fact that it reproduces what is supposed to be for the LHC in nature.

[ladybug15057]

I have used the distilled water now for almost 8 years with no ill effects. However it is a dead water and lacks every and anything that good water should contain. (key word, 'good')
Here in the U.S. there are so many impurities and many of which tap water conditioners alone cannot and do not remove. One being fluoride which is known to cause mutations in zoea. (and poisonous to rats...I know, not hermies but a mammal) There is no tap water conditioner sold on the market that removes the fluoride in the water, BUT there have been no studies to date that I know of on adult hermies as to whether there are any effects on them as adults?
The tap water conditioners are made for the public water companies daily 'doses' of chlorine and chloramine. When the public water company does treat their lines these 'doses' go much higher and if one does not put in the proper amount of dehclor in their water the chemicals could be higher than what is safe for hermies.
Using distilled bottle water does mean everything 'good' is lacking from it, so one does need to be very diligent as to offering a proper diet with all the vitamins and minerals a hermie needs as well as a properly mixed ocean water pond. This is a 100% must if one uses distilled (pure) water to keep healthy hermies, as well as extra calcium sources for which the distilled water can effect.

[Niko]

Here in the U.S. there are so many impurities and many of which tap water conditioners alone cannot and do not remove. One being fluoride which is known to cause mutations in zoea. (and poisonous to rats...I know, not hermies but a mammal) There is no tap water conditioner sold on the market that removes the fluoride in the water, BUT there have been no studies to date that I know of on adult hermies as to whether there are any effects on them as adults?

Same effects, fluoride is poisonous to all living beings (vegetals are greatly impacted too) and espcially to invertebrate (Daphnia magna LC50 is close to 97 mg/L, you should compare this to the amount in your tape water). Emmac and Marie,you're right because we don't have such problems in France, tape water are moderatly treated and chloride is the only substance added.

[emmac350]

I'd be interested in getting your water tested to see what is in your water. Then again, I'd love to know what's in my water here as I have just moved to Germany. No one drinks the tap water here - they look at me really strangely if I ask for just plain non-mineral water. I hate carbonation, and I want my water to taste like water, not whatever they add to it to make it 'mineral water.'

[ladybug15057]

Emmac and Marie,you're right because we don't have such problems in France, tape water are moderatly treated and chloride is the only substance added.

Thank you so much for this info Niko Many times it is hard when one lives in one country and not actually that familiar with certain things of another. Yet there are crabbers from all over the world who do join forums looking for help with the care of their hermies. The additive to tap water in France is good to know that water does not contain all the impurities that the water here in U.S. does.
May I use this information/posting/reply in an existing archive if I give credit to you? (and naturally link to this posting too so not to commit plagiarism)

[Niko]

Hi Marie, there's no problems for me, you can use this.

Off course, tape water in France is not free from substances of concerns for LHC and human health, because treatment plants have not enough efficiency to remove all of them ; however concentration stay low, we have sometimes pics of nitrates, but this coumpound are only dangerous in very high levels and reapeted exposures for a long time.

But i'm sure that chlorination is the only treatment apply to this water in France, off course the amount of chloride added can vary, but as i've said before and stated here http://crabbywiki.com/tiki-index.php?pa ... hlorinator (thanks Marie), chloride is added as a gaz and because it's a high volatil coumpound, it's very easy to remove (by bubbling water, let it 24/48 hours in a tank before used, it's faster if heat or exposed to the sun).

Boiling water can too destroy or remove a lot of volatil and thermolabil substances as many organic ones.

Fluor is never added in french tape water, but as said in the link, under gaz form, it's very volatil and may be easy to remove as chloride in similar ways.

Heavy metals, metals can't be remove, in tape water copper is the mostly found because of the pipes that bring water which are of copper. On the other hand, the water-conditioners have a big efficiency to cancel the toxicity of this element, it is for it that I say, in any case in France, the water of the network déchlorined and treated with an conditioner is perfectly adapted to the LHC ; me and hundred of people use it like this with success and no illness for animals.

[ladybug15057]

Thanks Niko! This is great info and I am sure those who are searching for info on their hermies will also find it quite useful. (from France)